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The interactive version of the OA Blue Book is now ready for submissions and testing. It is not yet fully integrated into this site but you can get to the search/submission menu by clicking here.
Some of the features of this system are:
- Anyone can submit new listings for consideration.
- Anyone can comment (right now all comments are anonymous but once the registration system is finished, they will be named.)
- Anyone can upload an image.
If you find any problems or have suggestions, please post comments here.
One can look at most recent changes be they new (”Pending”) issues, images, or comments. Use the “What’s New” tab in the menu at the top. I am finding that I’m already checking this each day to see what has been added. Very interesting.
Also, we’re working on an interactive lodge ancestry. Please help us update the information of the lodge family tree.
Some little known Blue Book “facts”:
There are, as of this posting, 2,817 lodges in the database. There are over 5,900 lodge/chapter combinations (some chapters have the same name but are with different lodges so the actual number of chapter names is less.)
Collector Mike LaTurno raised a definition debate concern that our hobby has not resolved. When is a patch an issue? When is it a variation? Up to this point in BB1’s history this has been left to the discretion of the editors. This leads to widely differing practices between lodges and regions. It is frustrating. As we go to BB2 we need get the principle(s) down. We can no longer leave it as a free-for-all nor rely on “I know it when I see it.”
So – When is a patch an issue?
When is a patch a variation?
We had an active discussion session at the recent ISCA Dallas TOR that included editors, ISCA Board members, dealers and general users. These really are not “minutes” so much as my recollection of the discussion and are open for others to continue this discussion.
A PDF of the handout for the session is here.
Version 2.0 – After a hearty discussion the general consensus was that after fifteen (15) years Blue Book is due for a new version. That is, a review of all lodges and issues. It could/will lead to new issue designations. One of the founding principles of Blue Book was that issue numbers will not change. But as the discussion in this blog indicates, there are arguments for and against this. The biggest reason for not changing issue numbers was the problems we had with Arapaho 2. That is, one could not just look at the catalog designation without also knowing which version of Arapaho was used. An ‘F1′ in the 1988 edition might have been and ‘F2′ in an earlier edition.
After discussing this, the consensus was that we would have new designations. If you saw an existing designation, such as “F1″ then one would know it was with the 1996-2006 Blue Book. We will need to come up with new shape designations so that when one sees the issue designation they’ll know it is post 2006. Some ideas were tossed out such as using new letters but the one that seems to make sense is to go with two letters. The on-line system will have a built in cross reference to ‘old’ Blue Book and ‘new’ Blue Book but issues after Blue Book 6th edition will be in ‘new’ Blue Book designation.
Adding Comments to issues – a feature of the new system is the ability to add comments to any issue – existing or pending. When we discussed this at Dallas the group thought that people need to give their full name when leaving a comment. This is both to create accountability and to allow follow-up if there’s a question. We’re working on the registration system which will have an e-mail confirmation requirement the first time one signs up with the web-site.
Editors are needed – See the blog discussion on this topic. Craig Leighty, ISCA President, and I talked about a possible Board position with ISCA to support and manage Blue Book editors.
Those are my notes. We did not get into the beta test links that are active. They are in the PDF if you’re curious. I’ve been reviewing the system with my programmer and we’re very close to going live. As my step-son, a co-founder in an internet start-up in San Francisco, says “If you’re not ashamed of the software you put out, you waited too long.”
We’re working on the on-line system but soon will be ready for new issue submission and editor review. This has always been a project for the hobby built by the hobby. If you are interested in being an editor, please reply to this post. You do not need to give your e-mail address out, but you will need to enter it when you enter your post so I can contact you.
What I need: name and the lodges you want to edit, whether you want to be a state(s) editor, and what state(s) you want to edit.
Third discussion topic from the pre-NOAC TOR. How do we handle lodges that do not have a number?
As background, starting in about 1998, I’m sure someone will correct me, the OA Committee did away with lodge numbers on lodge charters. From the BSA National Office’s perspective, every lodge is now known by its council number. I’m in lodge 88 but for the National BSA we’re the lodge associated with council 255. So, if the National office were asked our number they would say it is 255.
In our local history, even though we have gone through several mergers, lodge 88 was the 88th lodge formed chartered to Washtenaw-Livingston Council, later Portage Trails Council. As we merged with other councils, 88 was the lowest lodge number of the merging lodges and the lodges decided to retain that number. In many merger cases though the lodges did not retain one of the original numbers. In some cases they used a lodge number that was no longer active. That is how 313 which was Golden Eagle lodge 313 in Iowa later became 313 Tankiteke lodge in Connecticut (actually how that happened would be a nice piece of history to add to this system.)
We now have lodges that have not chosen a number or have chosen their council number which could be the same number as an active lodge.
So….How should Blue Book handle this?
At the pre-NOAC TOR several collectors made suggestions for additional items to be covered by blue book. Two ideas that were passed along were:
Include lodge totem pins (and other jewelry),
Include lodge clothing (shirts, hats, etc.)
What are your thoughts?
Currently we’re attending the pre-NOAC TOR. Several editors and collectors have come up to me to raise a number of issues that they would like to see addressed with this “New” Blue Book. I told them I would post them here as blog threads so all could see and comment.
This is the first one and is major: Should there be an overhaul of the issues in Blue Book as stated in the last, 6th, edition?
This could range from a wholesale renumbering, to dropping of issues, to dropping/adding variations, etc.. Blue Book exists to better the hobby so the hobby should have a say. BB’s success has been its participatory and collaborative nature, but with oversight.
While raising this question for comment, I want to bring to the front some comments in an earlier post. OA Blue Book will not become a ‘Wikipedia’. This is a standard’s project which means there must be structure, discipline and stability. That said, Blue Book will become much more open for all.
Dave Pede, a regional editor, and I have been corresponding for some months over the direction for Blue Book. He was involved with the digital version of Blue Book 6 and graciously has made available a searchable/printable version from his web-site:
Click here to go to it
We will be building from this base edition. We are working also with John Pannell and his OAImages.com web-site.
We acquired the rights to maintain and publish The Blue Book – the Standard Order of the Arrow Insignia Catalog from the Las Vegas International Scout Museum (LVISM). When Jeff Morley and Bill Topkis started this effort back in 1996, it was built as a community project bringing together more than 30 of us to compile and edit this reference work. Technology is going to allow us to open this up to an even wider group. And its a good thing too, as many of the Regional Editors I’ve talked with have had a tough time keeping up with all of the issues lodges are making.
The site for The Blue Book is, we think logically, OABlueBook.com. The site is very much “under development” but some of the things we will now be able to do:
- Anyone will be able to give submissions for new issues and varieties.
- Users will be able to add comments about issues including historical information such as number made, when issued, any restrictions, etc.
- More easily include new areas such as lodge totem pins or other memorabilia.
The catalog will always be updating. That is, there will no longer be ‘editions’ in the traditional sense. The 5th edition was the last mass-printing. The 6th edition had grown to requiring 3 volumes at a price of $100 which put it out of reach for many.
The site will be free and open to the public. Users will be able to make their own collecting lists, database searches, etc.. We will continue to collaborate with LVISM to maintain the reference collection of actual items. If you have suggestions for what you would like to see in an on-line version, please pass them on through the web-site.
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